Author Topic: I believe Trinity churches are anti-christ churches.  (Read 1930 times)

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guest6

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Jesus also gave His followers commission:

"Therefore, make disciple of all nations... teaching them to obey everything I have commended you".

this is evangelism.
So according to you this evangelism means to proclaim trin churches and all those who are Trinitarians as anti-Christ. Do you have scripture where Jesus said to do and say that? Have we been commanded by Jesus to do and say that to make disciples of all nations? How should we feel about people? Shouldn't we at least have compassion for them?

Matt. 9:36 But when Yeshua saw the crowds, he felt pity for them, for they were weary and wandering, like sheep without a shepherd.
Matt. 14:14 When He stepped ashore and saw a large crowd, He had compassion on them and healed their sick.
Mark 6_34 When Jesus stepped ashore and saw a large crowd, He had compassion on them, because they were like sheep without a shepherd. And He began to teach them many things.

And most importantly, without love we are a noisy gong and clanging cymbal. Who wants to listen to that?

Offline meshak

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And most importantly, without love we are a noisy gong and clanging cymbal. Who wants to listen to that?

You are plain wolfs wearing sheep's clothing when you approve of your members join in the military.

Trin churches are pretenders.

Offline Kerry

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You are plain wolfs wearing sheep's clothing when you approve of your members join in the military.

Trin churches are pretenders.
I just remembered another non-Trinitarian who waged war.  That was King Alaric I, the fellow who invaded and sacked Rome.   He was an Arian.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaric_I

Alaric began his career under the Goth soldiers Gainas and later joined the Roman army. Alaric's first appearance was as the leader of a mixed band of Goths and allied peoples who invaded Thrace in 391 and were stopped by the half-Vandal Roman General Stilicho. In 394 he led a Gothic force of 20,000 that helped the Eastern Roman Emperor Theodosius defeat the Frankish usurper Arbogast at the Battle of Frigidus. Despite sacrificing around 10,000 of his men, Alaric received little recognition from the Emperor. Disappointed, he left the army and was elected reiks of the Visigoths in 395, and marched toward Constantinople until he was diverted by Roman forces. He then moved southward into Greece, where he sacked Piraeus (the port of Athens) and destroyed Corinth, Megara, Argos, and Sparta. As a response, the Eastern emperor Flavius Arcadius appointed Alaric magister militum ("master of the soldiers") in Illyricum.

In 401 Alaric invaded Italy, but he was defeated by Stilicho at Pollentia (modern Pollenza) on April 6, 402. A second invasion that same year also ended in defeat at the Battle of Verona, though Alaric forced the Roman Senate to pay a large subsidy to the Visigoths. During Radagaisus' Italian invasion in 406, Alaric remained idle in Illyria. In 408, Western Emperor Flavius Honorius ordered the execution of Stilicho and his family, amid rumours that the general had made a deal with Alaric. Honorius then incited the Roman population to massacre tens of thousands of wives and children of foederati Goths serving in the Roman military. Subsequently, the Gothic soldiers defected to Alaric, increasing the size of his force to around 30,000 men, and joined his march on Rome to avenge their murdered families.[4]

Moving swiftly along Roman roads, Alaric sacked the cities of Aquileia and Cremona and ravaged the lands along the Adriatic Sea. The Visigothic leader thereupon laid siege to Rome in 408. Eventually, the Senate granted him a substantial subsidy. In addition, Alaric forced the Senate to liberate all 40,000 Gothic slaves in Rome. Honorius, however, refused to appoint Alaric as the commander of the Western Roman Army, and in 409 the Visigoths again surrounded Rome. Alaric lifted his blockade after proclaiming Attalus Western Emperor. Attalus appointed him magister utriusque militiae ("master of both services") but refused to allow him to send an army into Africa. Negotiations with Honorius broke down, and Alaric deposed Attalus in the summer of 410, and besieged Rome for the third time. Allies within the capital opened the gates for him on August 24, and for three days his troops sacked the city. Although the Visigoths plundered Rome, they treated its inhabitants humanely and burned only a few buildings. Having abandoned a plan to occupy Sicily and North Africa after the destruction of his fleet in a storm, Alaric died as the Visigoths were marching northward.


Yes, he was an Arian:

Stilicho's enemies later reproached him for having gained his victory by taking impious advantage of the great Christian festival. Alaric, too, was outwardly a Christian, though an Arian, not Orthodox though he continued to practice the Pagan rituals of his ancestors as well as observing Christian ritual practices. He had trusted to the sanctity of Easter for immunity from attack.[9]

Power corrupts. . . . Anyone no matter what his religion is apt to wage war if he thinks he can raise a bigger army than the next fellow. 

The Visigoths were a warlike people.  They waged wars in France, Spain, Italy and Africa for several centuries.  For more information see:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visigothic_Kingdom

Arianism in Spain also contributed to a future fight between the Catholic and Orthodox Churches.   At the Third Council of Toledo, the Catholics wanted to combat Arianism and  boldly added the infamous "filoque" clause to the creed of Constantinople.   A Pope, I forget which one, later adopted it into the official Catholic version.  The Orthodox Church was furious about it since the Nicene Council forbade altering the Nicene Creed.    How crazy can things get?  Pretty crazy actually when theologian sit around inventing things.   The "first" Nicene Creed was adopted at the Council of Nicea, of course; and that one was not to be changed.  But changed it was at the Council of Constantinople where the Bishops said it was the original creed set forth by the Council of Nicea (which it wasn't since they had changed it) and then putting a curse on anyone who dared change the version they set forth.   That didn't stop the Catholics in Spain or even the Pope from changing the second version and coming up with a third.   

How crazy is it?  If you asked the Pope today if the canons of the Council of Constantinople were infallible truth, he'd say yes; but then he couldn't explain why the Catholic Church refuses to use the version people agreed on but use one they devised themselves.    Did any of them know what they were talking about?  I doubt it.   The Trinitarians wanted to defeat  the non-Trinitarian Visigoths  and wanted to pretend they knew exactly how the Holy Spirit proceeds from both the Father and the Son. . . as if they had seen it for themselves and knew it to be true.   

Offline meshak

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I would like to share my back ground of my faith in God and Jesus

I grew up without much of moral standards. I am from Okinawa, Japan.

So I struggled to find out what is right or wrong all my life. I followed world's standards which it is not such high, even in Christian country like America, even though they claim to be a Christian country.

I got married when I was 24 and he was 25 years old. He is a Lutheran which is his family faith, one of Christian denomination. But they don't value much of Jesus' teachings and did not apply His teachings in their lives.

He is a retired soldier. We got married when he was stationed in Okinawa.

So we were both immature mentally and spiritually, and naturally our marriage was a disaster.

long story short, I became desperate when I was about 50 years old, I am 69 now, because of our disastrous marriage.

So I asked God to make me a Christian. Then I started read Jesus' teachings. I did not ask any Christians advice for Christianity, because they don't seem to have strong faith, and don't know what it is to be Jesus' followers. They made me confused with so many ideas.

And slowly my inner self have changed completely. My insecure feelings vanished, became confident in God and Jesus by striving to follow Jesus' high moral standards.

I can see clearly how those fake Christians disgracing Jesus with their lukewarm Christianity, and spreading false gospel to the world.

Jesus opened my eyes. I was blind and now I can see.

That's why I am so grateful for Jesus' teachings and strive to live by them.

Jesus teaches us to be salt and light of the world. That's why I believe true Christians don't engage in the wars and recommend their fellow believers to avoid all world's political affairs. This harmonize with Jesus' word of "His followers are not of the world".

Offline meshak

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I just remembered another non-Trinitarian who waged war.  That was King Alaric I, the fellow who invaded and sacked Rome.   He was an Arian.



I know some non trins are pro-military like mormons.


But those non-trins are super minority compare to trin churches.

remember my posts are all in general, meaning majority faith.

And the world believes christians are trinity believers.

Offline Kerry

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I know some non trins are pro-military like mormons.


But those non-trins are super minority compare to trin churches.

remember my posts are all in general, meaning majority faith.

And the world believes christians are trinity believers.

History shows me that that bad behavior is usually the result of people think they can do things and get away with it.   They start wars, they persecute others, they murder and steal -- breaking the Golden Rule.  Give people power, and they'll be tempted to ignore the Golden Rule. 

Bad religion comes in many disguises.  Indeed, a church could be right about its beliefs but fail to obey the Golden Rule.  I ask the Trinitarian Catholic Church and the Trinitarian Orthodox Church how they can justify their treatment of people who disagreed with them?  Even if their ideas about the Trinity were right, how can they justify disobeying Jesus the way they have? 

Paul wrote:

1 Corinthians 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.




Offline HOLLAND

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  • strive to see as well as to hear . . .
I would say, Meshak, that those who reject the Trinity must, perforce, reject scripture, but on to other things.  Your autobiography was very interesting:

I would like to share my back ground of my faith in God and Jesus

I grew up without much of moral standards. I am from Okinawa, Japan.

Japan has a very strong public morality based upon Buddhism and Shinto.  So you grew up disbelieving in the Buddha and in Shinto?

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So I struggled to find out what is right or wrong all my life. I followed world's standards which it is not such high, even in Christian country like America, even though they claim to be a Christian country.

America is not a Christian country.  It has not been claimed as such for many generations of its most significant citizens.  In the Book of Revelation, it is portrayed that people being called out of many nations are being saved but, significantly, does not say that nations are being saved.

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I got married when I was 24 and he was 25 years old. He is a Lutheran which is his family faith, one of Christian denomination. But they don't value much of Jesus' teachings and did not apply His teachings in their lives.

He is a retired soldier. We got married when he was stationed in Okinawa.

So we were both immature mentally and spiritually, and naturally our marriage was a disaster.

long story short, I became desperate when I was about 50 years old, I am 69 now, because of our disastrous marriage.

Sorry to hear this.  I wonder, though, if your disastrous marriage had much to do with your decision to reject the doctrine of the Trinity.  Are you rejecting the Trinity because of your husband?

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So I asked God to make me a Christian. Then I started read Jesus' teachings.

Why were you not lead by the Spirit of God who leads us to all truth?

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I did not ask any Christians advice for Christianity, because they don't seem to have strong faith, and don't know what it is to be Jesus' followers. They made me confused with so many ideas.

If you didn't have faith to begin with, how is that you seemed in your own mind to believe that these others did not have a strong faith?  Do you believe that you have strong faith now?

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And slowly my inner self have changed completely. My insecure feelings vanished, became confident in God and Jesus by striving to follow Jesus' high moral standards.

But is salvation found in your own works: your moral life, your seeking to escape from insecure feelings?

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I can see clearly how those fake Christians disgracing Jesus with their lukewarm Christianity, and spreading false gospel to the world.

Jesus opened my eyes. I was blind and now I can see.

That's why I am so grateful for Jesus' teachings and strive to live by them.

How do you know that you are being led by the Holy Spirit?  Is not the rejection of scripture a form of lukewarmness?

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Jesus teaches us to be salt and light of the world. That's why I believe true Christians don't engage in the wars and recommend their fellow believers to avoid all world's political affairs. This harmonize with Jesus' word of "His followers are not of the world".

Pacifism is only sound if it is seen in relation to other values.  It is not absolute of itself.  If you fail to fight great evils such as the Mongols or Hitler, at a certain point, your failure to fight them is a collaboration in their evil.

We cannot avoid political affairs and wars without becoming evil.
The humble, meek, merciful, just, pious and devout souls are everywhere of one religion; and when death has taken off the mask, they will know one another though the divers liveries they wear here make them strangers.
William Penn (1644-1718) from Some Fruits of Solitude (1718)

Offline meshak

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Sorry to hear this.  I wonder, though, if your disastrous marriage had much to do with your decision to reject the doctrine of the Trinity.


I did not say that at all.

I don't think you understand much of what I said in my testimony.

good day.

guest6

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You are plain wolfs wearing sheep's clothing when you approve of your members join in the military.

Trin churches are pretenders.
When you say "you", are you referring to me? You assume too much about other people. You go around throwing out accusations right and left about somebody you don't even know. And I will tell you right now that there is more to be concerned about than just the military and who is a trin believer. There is much more going on that you apparently either aren't aware of or don't care about.

For example, church abuse in both trin and non-trin churches, child sexual abuse in both trin and non-trin churches. But all you ever talk about is the military or whether they are trin and then condemn them while excusing non-trins just because they are non-trin and it doesn't seem to matter to you what they do. You defend them .

You need to stop being so biased and stop excusing church abuse and child sexual abuse in non-trin churches that are just as bad many trin churches. I call it like I see it. I am not biased. I see both sides. I know what's going on. But apparently you don't. So educate yourself before you go around slinging accusations at everybody.

You don't care about people. You don't care what's happening in churches to people. You don't care how they are treated or what happens to them and what their leaders do to them. All you care about is condemning the military and trin churches.

Offline meshak

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When you say "you", are you referring to me? You assume too much about other people. You go around throwing out accusations right and left about somebody you don't even know. And I will tell you right now that there is more to be concerned about than just the military and who is a trin believer. There is much more going on that you apparently either aren't aware of or don't care about.

For example, church abuse in both trin and non-trin churches, child sexual abuse in both trin and non-trin churches. But all you ever talk about is the military or whether they are trin and then condemn them while excusing non-trins just because they are non-trin and it doesn't seem to matter to you what they do. You defend them .

You need to stop being so biased and stop excusing church abuse and child sexual abuse in non-trin churches that are just as bad many trin churches. I call it like I see it. I am not biased. I see both sides. I know what's going on. But apparently you don't. So educate yourself before you go around slinging accusations at everybody.

You don't care about people. You don't care what's happening in churches to people. You don't care how they are treated or what happens to them and what their leaders do to them. All you care about is condemning the military and trin churches.

good day, heartsong.