Author Topic: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018  (Read 3309 times)

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Offline Kerry

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #310 on: July 21, 2018, 02:39:35 am »
Kerry -  ^

What a sporting world among many other things it would be if smaller militaries to start were needed.

I say encourage the oligarchs to take over the stadiums and give'em the Order of Putin or something like that. They just might need them one day for their new batch of kids enthralled by what they saw of their national "heroes" on the pitch in the Tournament.


para .  .  .  .
How about settling nagging international disputes with  soccer games?   Who owns that island that Canada and the US both say belongs to them?    I don't think it much matters really.   The continuing disagreement is more of a problem.   American agents arresting people fishing there was silly.  I say have a game and the winner gets it.  Of course, if I were President, I'd suggest conceding ownership  to Canada just to get rid of the problem.  In the long haul, it's not that important.  Good relations are more important.   

Have a trade dispute that keeps dragging on that is creating continuing friction between two countries and both sides want it resolved fast?  The WTO takes too long.   Have a game.   

Does that sound crazy?  Maybe, but it's not as crazy as having a war where people get killed and tons of money get wasted.   

Offline paralambano

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #311 on: July 21, 2018, 09:19:40 am »
Kerry -

Quote
How about settling nagging international disputes with  soccer games?   Who owns that island that Canada and the US both say belongs to them?    I don't think it much matters really.   The continuing disagreement is more of a problem.   American agents arresting people fishing there was silly.  I say have a game and the winner gets it.  Of course, if I were President, I'd suggest conceding ownership  to Canada just to get rid of the problem.  In the long haul, it's not that important.  Good relations are more important.   

Have a trade dispute that keeps dragging on that is creating continuing friction between two countries and both sides want it resolved fast?  The WTO takes too long.   Have a game.   

Does that sound crazy?  Maybe, but it's not as crazy as having a war where people get killed and tons of money get wasted.

Indeed.


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Offline Kerry

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #312 on: July 22, 2018, 01:19:51 pm »
More political fall-out.

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/mesut-ozil-blasts-media-sponsors-in-turkey-president-erdogan/1hofp1oib2wgl13u195fyepwb8

Mesut Ozil has released a second statement in response to the criticism both he and Ilkay Gundogan received in the wake of meeting with Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdogan, the Arsenal player this time taking aim at the German media and disloyal sponsors.

Ozil released the first piece of a three-part statement on Sunday morning, stating from the outset that there was no political agenda involved and that he was merely paying respect to the political office of the country of his ancestors.


Part of that statement read:

“Certain German newspapers are using my background and photo with President Erdogan as right-wing propaganda to further their political cause. Why else did they use pictures and headlines with my name as a direct explanation for defeat in Russia? They didn't criticise my performances, they didn't criticise the team's performances, they just criticised my Turkish ancestry and respect for my upbringing. This crosses a personal line that should never be crossed, as newspapers try to turn the nation of Germany against me.

“What I also find disappointing are the double standards that the media has. Lothar Matthaus (an honorary German national team captain) met with another world leader a few days back, and received almost no media criticism. Despite his role with the DFB (German national team), they have not asked him to publicly explain his actions and he continues to represent the players of Germany without any reprimand. If the media felt that I should have been left out of the World Cup squad, then surely he should be stripped of his honorary captaincy? Does my Turkish heritage make me a more worthy target?


I don't know how many newspapers criticized Matthaus; but one had a blistering story about his meeting with Putin.  The Russian press complained about it.

https://www.rt.com/news/432461-bild-matthaus-putin-meeting/

n a spiteful piece, a senior Bild editor called German football star Lothar Matthaus a Kremlin propaganda tool for meeting Putin. Matthaus countered that for fans like himself, hosting a wonderful World Cup beats politics.

When it comes to judging the quality of a football championship, Matthaus is as qualified as they come. After all, he played in five World Cups in his career, winning one in 1990. So last Friday, he and several other football figures went to the Kremlin and personally thanked Russian President Vladimir Putin for a well-organized tournament.

This drew the ire of Julian Reichelt, the editor-in-chief of German tabloid Bild. In an editorial, he called Putin a murderer and said Matthaus should not have shaken his “bloody hand.”

“Matthaus is too clever not to know what horrible crimes Putin is directly responsible for. Knowingly and voluntarily, he lets a murderer and cynic, who despises sports, to shine in his splendor,” Reichelt wrote. The piece compares Putin to “murdering despots” and claims that “he opposes irrefutable facts with his own propaganda spit.”

Therefore, the editor concludes, the German football star “makes himself part of this propaganda.”

The “irrefutable facts,” of course, refer to the many allegations against Putin in the Western media over the years, from the “Novichok” poisonings in the UK to the bombing of children in Syria, to the doping of the entire Russian team during the Winter Olympics in Sochi. Those “facts” are often based on hearsay, biased interpretations, or assessments not backed by actual evidence, but if Reichelt says so, who could refute him?

Bild’s position on Russia is hardly surprising. After all, it made a spectacle out of refusing to count Russia’s medals from the 2016 Olympic Games, and recently accused Putin of demeaning German Chancellor Angela Merkel… by giving her flowers.

As for Matthaus, he seems unfazed by the criticism.

“Politics and sport cannot be separated, but for us sportsmen only the peaceful and fair competition counts. The people of Russia have organized a fantastic World Cup and shown the world their hospitality and cordiality, for that they deserve thanks!” he tweeted.

Offline Kerry

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #313 on: July 22, 2018, 02:20:24 pm »
And in Egypt, the Muslim Brotherhood was blamed for Egypt's lackluster performance in the World Cup.  What?

https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/sisi-salah-egypt-failed-world-cup-180719080842364.html

Fresh off a massively disappointing performance at the 2018 World Cup, the president of the Egyptian Football Association (EFA), Hany Abo Rida, deflected criticism of his team's woeful play by casting blame on the Muslim Brotherhood. The Pharaohs lost all three of their matches in a group widely thought to have offered Egypt a serious chance to advance to the knockout stage of the tournament.

In his comments to al-Watan newspaper, Abo Rida neglected to specify how the banned Islamist organisation contributed to Egypt's 3-1 loss to Russia or how it conspired to squander the lead in the 2-1 defeat to perpetual World Cup laughingstock Saudi Arabia in the group's final match.


It is curious what Abo Rida meant.  Were there players who could have played for Egypt but they're living outside Egypt because of their political leanings and thus didn't feel safe returning to Egypt or being part of the national team? 

Earlier this year, in a blatant violation of FIFA statutes regarding the politicisation of football associations, the Egypt Football Association (EFA) held a press event to offer its endorsement of el-Sisi in an election that was expected to be little more than a coronation.

What if anything was done about this?

Here's a photo of President al-Sisi and Mo Salah from a meeting shortly before the team departed for Russia:



The article says of this meeting:

Seizing on his global popularity, the EFA went to great lengths to make Salah the face of Egyptian football, and by association, the face of a regime with an obvious image problem.

As Salah's face adorned the side of an EgyptAir aircraft, the player protested the unauthorised use of his image as "extremely insulting" in a rare public criticism of state officials.

Then, not long after the team arrived in Russia, reports emerged that Salah was privately expressing his frustrations with the poor management of the squad's World Cup campaign that included, among other things, far greater emphasis on staged publicity events than proper training and match preparation.

Salah was particularly frustrated at being used as a political pawn by the EFA as it attempted to make inroads with Ramzan Kadyrov, the authoritarian ruler of Chechnya, which served as the Egyptian team's base during the tournament.

In images that went viral on social media, Salah was paraded by Kadyrov and even granted honorary Chechen citizenship. Owing to these frustrations, and the team's ultimately dismal performance, reports surfaced after Egypt's exit from the tournament that Salah was considering international retirement.


My sympathy to Salah for this kind of complication.     I think the EFA's choice for their team base could have been better.  Why pick Chechnya?  Why put players under this sort of pressure?   Why couldn't Egypt  just let him play be football and be grateful he was playing for them?   

Offline paralambano

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #314 on: July 22, 2018, 06:10:12 pm »
Kerry -  ^

These teams and clubs need to wise-up. Stick to soccer. Some of these players are still young and perhaps naive. The older ones ought to know better about appearances. Especially with the Israel-Argentina episode. Lothar should be on protecting the players side not cementing politics to sports. Some talented players might be hesitant to play for their national team with this nonsense happening.

Poor Salah. He ought to make sure the EFA knows exactly where he stands if Egypt wants him on the team.

As far as I can see, Mesut brought this on himself. No, not the racist taunts and ugliness. He represents Germany out there on the pitch and whenever he's wearing the kit or on the team. He plays for Germany, not Turkey. In sport, that's all sporting fans should care about, the soccer heritage. This is how our nation plays soccer, not how we mine, build ships, trade, etc. Weird enough that players get themselves mixed up with their own nation's politicoes who are here today and gone tomorrow, good or bad.


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Offline Kerry

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #315 on: July 24, 2018, 10:04:07 am »
Kerry -  ^

These teams and clubs need to wise-up. Stick to soccer. Some of these players are still young and perhaps naive. The older ones ought to know better about appearances. Especially with the Israel-Argentina episode. Lothar should be on protecting the players side not cementing politics to sports. Some talented players might be hesitant to play for their national team with this nonsense happening.

Poor Salah. He ought to make sure the EFA knows exactly where he stands if Egypt wants him on the team.
FIFA could help too by applying a little pressure.  Perhaps they have behind the scenes.

Quote
As far as I can see, Mesut brought this on himself. No, not the racist taunts and ugliness. He represents Germany out there on the pitch and whenever he's wearing the kit or on the team. He plays for Germany, not Turkey. In sport, that's all sporting fans should care about, the soccer heritage. This is how our nation plays soccer, not how we mine, build ships, trade, etc. Weird enough that players get themselves mixed up with their own nation's politicoes who are here today and gone tomorrow, good or bad.


para .  .  .  .
I would hope people know how to avoid complications; but on the other hand, players are used to people inviting them places and asking to have their pictures taken with them.  He may not have attached much importance to it.

It seems Erdogan attached more importance to it since he released that photo shortly before the election.  It was a close election too, every little thing could count.  It looks to me as if Erdogan was using Mesut. 

Well, he said he had enough and quit the national team, charging racism.  I think that was a mistake.   

Erdogan continued to fan the flames.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/soccer/erdogan-says-called-ozil-praises-decision-to-quit-german-team/ar-AAAlaxO

President Recep Tayyip Erdogan on Tuesday said he had spoken to Turkish-origin football star Mesut Ozil after his decision to quit the German team on the grounds of racism, offering his praise for the Arsenal player's move.

"Last night I spoke to Mesut. His attitude in the statement is completely patriotic," Erdogan said, quoted by state TRT Haber broadcaster.

"It is not possible to accept this kind of racist attitude towards a young man who poured so much sweat for the German national team's success. This cannot be tolerated."


What did he mean, that Mesut was being a Turkish patriot or a German patriot? 

Ozil, a key member of the squad which won the 2014 World Cup, criticised the German Football Association (DFB) bosses, sponsors and the media.

He lamented a lack of support from DFB president Reinhard Grindel.

"In the eyes of Grindel and his supporters, I am German when we win, but I am an immigrant when we lose," Ozil, 29, wrote.

But the association said in a statement on Monday that it rejected "the notion that the DFB is associated with racism".

In his statement, Ozil addressed critics of the photo and said that he was not making a political statement when he appeared with the Turkish leader before the World Cup finals.

"I have two hearts, one German and one Turkish," said Ozil.

Justice Minister Abdulhamit Gul on Monday congratulated Ozil, saying he had "scored the most beautiful goal against the virus of fascism."


I think he waited too long before saying it was just a photo and he wasn't endorsing anything political.  By the time he got around to saying it, things had gotten out of control. 

Maybe Merkel could do some "politics" herself since I imagine the people complaining about Mesut were anti-immigrant folks who saw this as a way to undermine her.  She could call him up and say, "You visited Erdogan.  Want to come visit me?"    Have him over for dinner and photos.   Have the whole German team over.   He might decide to join the national team again if Merkel asked him to.   

I found out at Wikipedia that he likes doing charity, and it's not just for Muslims.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesut_Özil#Philanthropy

As part of the BigShoe project, Özil donated his 2014 World Cup winnings, an estimated Ł240,000, to pay for 23 sick Brazilian children to have medical surgery as a "personal thank you for the hospitality of the people of Brazil."

In May 2016, international media covered Özil's visit to the Zaatari refugee camp in Jordan, home to around 80,000 people displaced as a result of the Syrian civil war. Özil toured the camp as well as playing with children, signing autographs and handing out football shirts.

In 2017, he worked with the charity My Shining Star to make a child cancer patient's dreams come true. He invited the child, Charlie, to be a guest at his private box and in the player's lounge during a game with Sunderland at Emirates Stadium.


He played football with the kids at the refugee camp. 



Offline paralambano

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #316 on: July 24, 2018, 10:51:25 am »
Kerry - ^

There's going to be an overhaul of the German team and Ozil was probably on the way out anyway. His play has been down somewhat lately for club and country.

Better that politicians go to clubs and national teams than they go to them. That way the politicians look more like sports-tourists. Merkel had already visited the national team in Italy just prior to the World Cup.

You know, a somewhat similar thing happened when France won it all. Trevor Noah, American TV talk-show host, stated that it was Africa that won the World Cup since many of its players are of African heritage. As far as I'm concerned, Noah's wrong if he's serious about it. France won it because all of its players volunteered to play for France, not African nations. One chooses who they are from moment-to-moment and there were plenty long moments when all France's players chose to be French.

I agree with what Obama said about it: "Just look at the French football team. Not all of those folks looked like Gauls to me, but they are French - they are French."


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Offline Kerry

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #317 on: July 26, 2018, 12:13:37 am »
Kerry - ^

There's going to be an overhaul of the German team and Ozil was probably on the way out anyway. His play has been down somewhat lately for club and country.
Hindsight?

Quote
Better that politicians go to clubs and national teams than they go to them. That way the politicians look more like sports-tourists. Merkel had already visited the national team in Italy just prior to the World Cup.
Yes, it is better that way.  The political implications aren't there. 

Erdogan might have a problem with that since he doesn't travel that much.   I don't think he does.   I don't remember reading about visits other than the future trip to South Africa where he'll meet up with Putin.   People seem to visit him.  It's as if he's playing the role of Roman Emperor or Caliph and people come to him.   Perhaps he doesn't feel safe leaving Turkey.   

Quote
You know, a somewhat similar thing happened when France won it all. Trevor Noah, American TV talk-show host, stated that it was Africa that won the World Cup since many of its players are of African heritage. As far as I'm concerned, Noah's wrong if he's serious about it. France won it because all of its players volunteered to play for France, not African nations. One chooses who they are from moment-to-moment and there were plenty long moments when all France's players chose to be French.

Quote
I agree with what Obama said about it: "Just look at the French football team. Not all of those folks looked like Gauls to me, but they are French - they are French."
I figured Noah was half-joking.  Ozil is third-generation German.   I don't think he could play for Turkey if he wanted.   Europe seems to be adjusting to the question of national identity.   

I think something similar is happening in the US.   When Trump talks about making America great again, it's hard to figure out what he means unless it has something to do with culture or race.  I'd say the US was in good shape when Trump took office.     Crime was down.  Even the number of abortions declined under Obama.    The economy was in good shape.  It had collapsed at the end of a Republican President and recovered under Obama, yet the perception among many was that the US was going downhill economically. 

Offline paralambano

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #318 on: July 26, 2018, 10:19:51 am »
Kerry -

Quote
Hindsight?

?

Quote
Erdogan might have a problem with that since he doesn't travel that much.   I don't think he does.   I don't remember reading about visits other than the future trip to South Africa where he'll meet up with Putin.   People seem to visit him.  It's as if he's playing the role of Roman Emperor or Caliph and people come to him.   Perhaps he doesn't feel safe leaving Turkey.

These guys are public servants so they should be the ones running around -  -  even in Byzantium  ;D.


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Offline paralambano

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Re: FIFA World Cup (Men) Russia 2018
« Reply #319 on: July 26, 2018, 10:57:24 am »
So, the fan vote-count's in for the goal of the Tournament. Pavard said:

"I was trying to hit it in the direction it came from, which is what the strikers always tell me. I didn't think it over, and when it went in I just felt so happy.":




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